Roflol
- Thread starter Ky
- Start date
Ky
Stupid is as stupid does
I've always said Cricket > Football and also Rugby > Football. Doesn't need a shit result for me to change my opinion. Cricket and Rugby aren't full of overpaid prima-donnas who think their shit is marmalade and supporters whose IQ is less than their shoe size. So what was your point?Janie said:
Janie
Full Member
You still enjoy football. You still support a team, you'll still celebrate when West Ham win, you care - while you may prefer Cricket and Rugby (but you play squash so that's expected) you still enjoy football and would support and get excited when England are in the world cup and want them to qualify (which is why laughing at last nights result doesn't quite ring true). If Rugby and Cricket were as popular as football they would be full of overpaid premadonna's as well, infact that Pieterson is one already 
Next time you dare mention Cricketers being Intelligent folk i'm going to post a picture of Matthew 'Hoggy' Hoggard - Wonder who taken his village idiot job when he's on tour. (Oh and if you answer me, i'll hurt you).
Next time you dare mention Cricketers being Intelligent folk i'm going to post a picture of Matthew 'Hoggy' Hoggard - Wonder who taken his village idiot job when he's on tour. (Oh and if you answer me, i'll hurt you
).
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Ky
Stupid is as stupid does
Matthew Hoggard is a reasonably smart bloke; smart enough to have pursued a career as a Vet if he didn't make it as a Cricket player. You always judge on appearances and in the case of Hoggard, yes, he looks a bit of a yokel but thats part and parcel of the way he wants to be seen. He writes a lucid and intelligent, non-ghosted column for The Times.
I was laughing at the football? Since when? I was irritated by last nights match but equally, I don't love football so much that my world would end if we didn't qualify for the World Cup.
If Cricket was as well paid as football players still wouldn't act the prick. You never see a player arguing with the referee/umpire and calling him a wanker like you do in Football. Or rolling around like a great big girl when they've been hurt (and that includes getting smacked in the head in Cricket and getting literally beaten to a pulp in Rugby). Football is full of pansies who leap around like they've been shot when someone clips their little toe.
Yes I like football but I despair at the way the game has gone in recent years and players behaviour is nothing short of deplorable.
I was laughing at the football? Since when? I was irritated by last nights match but equally, I don't love football so much that my world would end if we didn't qualify for the World Cup.
If Cricket was as well paid as football players still wouldn't act the prick. You never see a player arguing with the referee/umpire and calling him a wanker like you do in Football. Or rolling around like a great big girl when they've been hurt (and that includes getting smacked in the head in Cricket and getting literally beaten to a pulp in Rugby). Football is full of pansies who leap around like they've been shot when someone clips their little toe.
Yes I like football but I despair at the way the game has gone in recent years and players behaviour is nothing short of deplorable.
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Ky
Stupid is as stupid does
He pushes it to the limits, yes, but he doesn't call the Umpire a wanker and tell him to fuck himself and, well, I'm pushing it a bit calling him a cheat anyway but that's cos I can't stand the little fat fuck as he's tormented the England team for 12 years.
But if you want to try and argue that Cricketers are badly behaved and Football players aren't, please fee free.
But if you want to try and argue that Cricketers are badly behaved and Football players aren't, please fee free.
Unbeliever
Happily Deposed GM
Sheesh ... the things you read
Galias
\o/
Warning: LONG POST AHEAD
I'm afraid it's not bollocks, far from it.
For a start, it does matter what position you are played in, it can make a HUGE difference. I'll give you an example from personal experience. When I used to play football as a wee lil' kiddie like most I chased the ball all round the pitch and didn't care. All I knew was there was the ball, we needed the ball and I was going to get it and that was fine. Me and some of my mates then joined the scouts, had a team formed and were put into the local scout league. We promptly got stuffed 13-0 in our first game. My old man (who Liath will tell you knows a thing or two about footy to say the very least) decided enough was enough and he was going to organise us all and became the manager. Now obviously someone had to play on the left where no one wants to, who was the child he could influence the most even thought he was right footed? Me! So I became our left winger (which has stood me in good stead since as hardly anyone wants to play there so I've always got a position to occupy \o/ ). Later on that year after a lot of hard work we went to the other team�s place and beat them 5-3.
The point of the above story is that it leads onto this. I am now used to playing on the left hand side of a football pitch. Put me on the right hand side and it actually feels wrong, almost claustrophobic. Seriously, that white line is on the wrong side of me, is where I normally expect space to be and it just isn't right. Meanwhile on the other side where I expect the comfort and cover of that line suddenly there is vast open spaces occupied by players! This has even carried over into other sports as well, Bullfrog formed a basketball team... Where did I end up playing? Out on the left, the right hand side of a pitch seems alien to me now. I can play on the right, but I am likely to resemble a rabbit in headlights and not play as well as I will on the left.
It's the same with those players. They may well play 4-5-1 or whatever for their clubs, but play them slightly out of position or even just with different players with different abilities around them to what they are used to in that formation and things will go wrong.
Example, for a start Rooney doesn't play on the left behind the striker for Manyoo, he is in a free role just behind the striker and roams around the entire pitch. That makes a difference for a start before I even get onto the fact that playing that position in support of Rudd Van Horseface is a completely different proposition to playing it behind Owen / Defoe. Rudd will hold the ball up while Rooney charges forward, Owen and Defoe don't do that, they offer you something else. Either put Rooney up front in a 2 or if you are going to play him off the strikers, put him in the middle behind a pair such as Owen and Defoe, the extra man up front will create more gaps in the opposition for Roo to run into with the ball (as the front men can't hold it up).
Earlier I moaned about how badly Cole was out of position for the goal. Thinking about it more it has dawned on me why that was the case. Beckham is NOT a holding midfielder. He may be spraying great passes around from that position all night but he gets caught in possession horribly and that leads to huge problems. About 15 mins before the goal he got caught with the ball just in front of the defence which led to 5 mins of sustained NI pressure. You wouldn't catch Keane, Davids or Viera having that happen to them. I think Cole had seen this happening and was collapsing in to help cover the centre. Beckham is a world class right winger, I don't care if he thinks he is gods gift to central midfield, at best he is OK in that position when you compare it to what he can do out on the right. Getting him to play on the right is playing to his strengths too, you've got to be strong enough to let him know what he is good at and what he is bad at, all part of management.
Also, this English problem left midfield spot? Has Sven never seen Gareth Barry? He is perfect for that role. Good getting forward and a great defender too who will be able to cover when Cole goes forward (notice Cole doesn't rampage forward the way he did a few seasons ago? That is because he doesn't have the cover to give him the confidence to do that!)
And as for the substitutions..!? Taking SWP off and bringing JCole on in his place?! Good grief. Better sub there = JCole for Beckham, put JCole out on the left (where he has proved he can play too) put Roo up front in a 2 and take it to them. If you can't take the talisman of Becks off, then sub JCole for SWP as happened but then put JCole on the left, push Roo up front and put Becks on the right where SWP was.
That is just a couple of examples, there were many more on that pitch last night. Yes, they are also a bunch of over paid chavs who didn't perform but where does the confidence and that will to win come from in the first place? Due to this manager�s ineptness and meekness they know they aren't playing for their places, he's so clueless that most of them know they are automatic selections. And as for his nail biting display on the touchline last night? Well it is hardly going to inspire the will to win is it?
Yes, they are highly paid professionals and should be able to adapt, but just like most of us they have their strengths (my work don�t ask me to stop programming and start producing art even though I have the same tools on my desk as the artists). These strengths should be played to and used to our advantage and at the moment they are not. What is happening is the old cliche "Square pegs into round holes" and you know what? It isn't working.
I'm afraid it's not bollocks, far from it.
For a start, it does matter what position you are played in, it can make a HUGE difference. I'll give you an example from personal experience. When I used to play football as a wee lil' kiddie like most I chased the ball all round the pitch and didn't care. All I knew was there was the ball, we needed the ball and I was going to get it and that was fine. Me and some of my mates then joined the scouts, had a team formed and were put into the local scout league. We promptly got stuffed 13-0 in our first game. My old man (who Liath will tell you knows a thing or two about footy to say the very least) decided enough was enough and he was going to organise us all and became the manager. Now obviously someone had to play on the left where no one wants to, who was the child he could influence the most even thought he was right footed? Me! So I became our left winger (which has stood me in good stead since as hardly anyone wants to play there so I've always got a position to occupy \o/ ). Later on that year after a lot of hard work we went to the other team�s place and beat them 5-3.
The point of the above story is that it leads onto this. I am now used to playing on the left hand side of a football pitch. Put me on the right hand side and it actually feels wrong, almost claustrophobic. Seriously, that white line is on the wrong side of me, is where I normally expect space to be and it just isn't right. Meanwhile on the other side where I expect the comfort and cover of that line suddenly there is vast open spaces occupied by players! This has even carried over into other sports as well, Bullfrog formed a basketball team... Where did I end up playing? Out on the left, the right hand side of a pitch seems alien to me now. I can play on the right, but I am likely to resemble a rabbit in headlights and not play as well as I will on the left.
It's the same with those players. They may well play 4-5-1 or whatever for their clubs, but play them slightly out of position or even just with different players with different abilities around them to what they are used to in that formation and things will go wrong.
Example, for a start Rooney doesn't play on the left behind the striker for Manyoo, he is in a free role just behind the striker and roams around the entire pitch. That makes a difference for a start before I even get onto the fact that playing that position in support of Rudd Van Horseface is a completely different proposition to playing it behind Owen / Defoe. Rudd will hold the ball up while Rooney charges forward, Owen and Defoe don't do that, they offer you something else. Either put Rooney up front in a 2 or if you are going to play him off the strikers, put him in the middle behind a pair such as Owen and Defoe, the extra man up front will create more gaps in the opposition for Roo to run into with the ball (as the front men can't hold it up).
Earlier I moaned about how badly Cole was out of position for the goal. Thinking about it more it has dawned on me why that was the case. Beckham is NOT a holding midfielder. He may be spraying great passes around from that position all night but he gets caught in possession horribly and that leads to huge problems. About 15 mins before the goal he got caught with the ball just in front of the defence which led to 5 mins of sustained NI pressure. You wouldn't catch Keane, Davids or Viera having that happen to them. I think Cole had seen this happening and was collapsing in to help cover the centre. Beckham is a world class right winger, I don't care if he thinks he is gods gift to central midfield, at best he is OK in that position when you compare it to what he can do out on the right. Getting him to play on the right is playing to his strengths too, you've got to be strong enough to let him know what he is good at and what he is bad at, all part of management.
Also, this English problem left midfield spot? Has Sven never seen Gareth Barry? He is perfect for that role. Good getting forward and a great defender too who will be able to cover when Cole goes forward (notice Cole doesn't rampage forward the way he did a few seasons ago? That is because he doesn't have the cover to give him the confidence to do that!)
And as for the substitutions..!? Taking SWP off and bringing JCole on in his place?! Good grief. Better sub there = JCole for Beckham, put JCole out on the left (where he has proved he can play too) put Roo up front in a 2 and take it to them. If you can't take the talisman of Becks off, then sub JCole for SWP as happened but then put JCole on the left, push Roo up front and put Becks on the right where SWP was.
That is just a couple of examples, there were many more on that pitch last night. Yes, they are also a bunch of over paid chavs who didn't perform but where does the confidence and that will to win come from in the first place? Due to this manager�s ineptness and meekness they know they aren't playing for their places, he's so clueless that most of them know they are automatic selections. And as for his nail biting display on the touchline last night? Well it is hardly going to inspire the will to win is it?
Yes, they are highly paid professionals and should be able to adapt, but just like most of us they have their strengths (my work don�t ask me to stop programming and start producing art even though I have the same tools on my desk as the artists). These strengths should be played to and used to our advantage and at the moment they are not. What is happening is the old cliche "Square pegs into round holes" and you know what? It isn't working.
England were dire and Ireland played out of their skins.
As for not blaming it on the manager I think he's the person the buck stops with, yes the players deserve all the criticism they get but the manager picks the squad and decides on the formation. He's seen time and time again that Lampard and Gerrard don't play well together but still plays them at the same time.
Look at Ireland and Scotland and see what a difference a good manager makes, Ireland played out of their skins, the players were motivated and believed they could win, I'm not saying Sanchez is a great tactical manager but he got his team to do the job. Scotland have also been transformed since Walter Smith became manager, same players but a different team on the field, as can be seen by the results.
A couple of pluses last night, England need a holding midfield player and I think Beckham did a good job passed the ball well. but not sure he could play that position against a better team because of his lack of tackling ability, or if it would work with Gerrard/Lampard playing in front of him. I have to admit I doubt if either Lampard or Gerrard would want to have Beckham playing the holding role as he likes to make the long pass rather than give it to either of the attacking midfielders to run at the opposition. Luke young looked quite good and Wright-Phillips looked good as well.
Personally I think its time for Sven to go but the big question is who do you get to replace him? Sam Allerdyce? Alan Curbishly? No idea myself.
As for not blaming it on the manager I think he's the person the buck stops with, yes the players deserve all the criticism they get but the manager picks the squad and decides on the formation. He's seen time and time again that Lampard and Gerrard don't play well together but still plays them at the same time.
Look at Ireland and Scotland and see what a difference a good manager makes, Ireland played out of their skins, the players were motivated and believed they could win, I'm not saying Sanchez is a great tactical manager but he got his team to do the job. Scotland have also been transformed since Walter Smith became manager, same players but a different team on the field, as can be seen by the results.
A couple of pluses last night, England need a holding midfield player and I think Beckham did a good job passed the ball well. but not sure he could play that position against a better team because of his lack of tackling ability, or if it would work with Gerrard/Lampard playing in front of him. I have to admit I doubt if either Lampard or Gerrard would want to have Beckham playing the holding role as he likes to make the long pass rather than give it to either of the attacking midfielders to run at the opposition. Luke young looked quite good and Wright-Phillips looked good as well.
Personally I think its time for Sven to go but the big question is who do you get to replace him? Sam Allerdyce? Alan Curbishly? No idea myself.
Janie
Full Member
Ky said:
That's because of it's popularity, the money and the media. Very very young men, boys in some case are suddenly given tons of money without learning about responsability. It's all very well saying crickets are more inteligent, that's because they are allowed a normal life, 'Freddie' Flintoff is 27 old enough and sensible enough with 'a normal' life experience to understand the fame he'll end up getting - if he was 17 and spent his last 3 years in a cricket academy and earning more in a week than his whole family earn in a year would he look so good? Still for every thick footballer you do get the odd sensible one.
Flight
Full Member
Owen is bloody useless as the one up front in a 4-5-1, which is why more managers weren't in for him.
Lampard and Gerrard are too similar to play together.
Beckham is bloody useless as a holding midfielder. He's also been crap for Enggurrland for a long time; should have been dropped ages ago. But SGE = Monty Burns and Beckham = Smithers.
WTF are we playing 4-5-1 against a team as poor as NI ?
The clueless gimp subbed SWP and Gerrard, when he should have brought off Beckham and Lampard, who had a dreadful game.
Finally, old news, but I still can never get over how much Rooney = Shrek.
Lampard and Gerrard are too similar to play together.
Beckham is bloody useless as a holding midfielder. He's also been crap for Enggurrland for a long time; should have been dropped ages ago. But SGE = Monty Burns and Beckham = Smithers.
WTF are we playing 4-5-1 against a team as poor as NI ?
The clueless gimp subbed SWP and Gerrard, when he should have brought off Beckham and Lampard, who had a dreadful game.
Finally, old news, but I still can never get over how much Rooney = Shrek.
Agravaine
Professional Slacker
Personally I can never understand why Beckham, whom I used to view as one of the best crossers of the ball in the world, is ever played anywhere other than the right wing.
Sure he might do a decent job in central midfield (althought not as the holding player) but he used to do an outstanding job on the wing which seems more important to me especially when you already have various "proper" central midfielders to choose from.
Sure he might do a decent job in central midfield (althought not as the holding player) but he used to do an outstanding job on the wing which seems more important to me especially when you already have various "proper" central midfielders to choose from.
truthfully you played it case we are poor. you came here, you know you going to the world cup, you know you don't have to win you know that on a day you play even half well you can beat us. and after watch last night game i belive that the english team was send out with the instruction to put on a good show, but don't do anything that might get you hurt, after all you don't need this game so why spend months off on the sick (and loose a shit load of money)if you don't have to.
thhe NI team came out and play there hearts out and wanted to win, gfor lets face it for england in a few weeks time this game will be forgot about no one in england will care.
in NI the game will be talked about for years(remember it 78 years since we last beat you at home) and for many of the players it will be the highlight of there careers
Agravaine
Professional Slacker
Something I just mentioned to Ky:
I noticed something last night which had escaped me up until now.
England are the Newcastle of the international football community.
Large fanatical fan base? Check.
Living on past glories whilst claiming to be a big team? Check.
Like to think they're as good as the best teams when they're clearly not? Check.
Pundits look at the squad and can't understand why they don't do better? Check.
Mediocre at best with the occasional good performance but choke in big matches? Check.
I noticed something last night which had escaped me up until now.
England are the Newcastle of the international football community.
Large fanatical fan base? Check.
Living on past glories whilst claiming to be a big team? Check.
Like to think they're as good as the best teams when they're clearly not? Check.
Pundits look at the squad and can't understand why they don't do better? Check.
Mediocre at best with the occasional good performance but choke in big matches? Check.